Gender Critical Autistic Voices - Rachel Schoenberger Interview
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Rachel Schoenberger
Canada
18-24
Female
White, aromantic asexual, Christian
Suspected/Self diagnosed autistic
Why do you think autistic people may struggle with identity issues, like Gender?
I think there are a number of reasons why autistic people are more likely to struggle with gender identity issues. Part of it is just being autistic makes one feel different and left out, so some autistic people may be inclined to identify as non-binary because they do not feel like the majority of men or women they have met and wish to call themselves something other so as to not stand out so much among their birth sex. Language such as "not feeling like a man/woman" is often used in trans communities and many autistic people may relate to that if they do not share the same interests of their peers or have been made fun of for not fitting in. Autistic teens especially may become interested in identifying as trans through online communities that share their special interest as such spaces tend to be very gender-affirming and promote trans ideology. Autistic women also tend to be more masculine than allistic women and prefer things like playing sports and doing math to more traditionally feminine activities. Besides that, autistic women may like having short hair as having long hair can be challenging sensory-wise and having short hair as a female may be frowned upon in certain communities.
Do you feel you "fit in" with your own sex class or the opposite sex class? Has your perspective on this changed over time? Do you feel you share more traits, patterns of behaviour or similarities with your own sex or the opposite sex?
Growing up, I did not feel I fit in with either boys or girls. I did not meet anyone else like me and often felt different from other people. Many of my traits align more with males than females as I have never cared much about my physical appearance, I care significantly more for facts as opposed to feelings and dislike certain traditionally feminine activities like shopping, wearing dresses, and reading the overly-hyped-up romantasy novels so beloved by other women my age. I do not feel I fit in much with women but I do not feel I fit in with men either as I have some more feminine traits as well.
Do you think being undiagnosed autistic can lead people into searching for answers about themselves, and potentially stumbling into the wrong place for an answer? Growing up autistic and feeling different - how do you think this plays into believing you are trans?
I do think that being undiagnosed as an autistic person can lead someone into searching for answers in the wrong places such as transgenderism. Growing up autistic without knowing it can be hard as I did not understand why I was so different from my classmates. I realized fairly early on that I was not a girly girl and the thought of being one disgusted me because I saw it as extremely shallow. When I was eight years old, I wanted people to call me by a male name and I remember asking my parents why I could not be a boy. The people in my life did not go along with this (for which I am now grateful) but I do wish more had been done when I was a child to find out why I felt so different and had such difficulty with social interactions and making friends.
Do you FEEL like a man/woman? Is being male or female a ‘feeling’?
I do not believe that being male or female is a feeling but is rather something immutable and grounded in biology. I would not say that I feel like either a man or woman but I have come to accept that I am a woman with more masculine behaviours and interests. Being autistic does affect how I feel about myself and how others perceive me. I do relate to the experience of alexithymia and that may very well have something to do with the way I see myself.
Do you think searching for answers about yourself, and finding out you are autistic, is similar to the trans experience? Do you feel a kinship to trans experiences? What is the difference with our experiences? What age were you when you felt you had developed mentally and emotionally?
I found out I am autistic from information on the internet which is a place many people discover that they want to identify as some other gender, so there are some similarities. Those who struggle with gender dysphoria and those who are autistic may have a similar experience in noticing they are different from those around them and searching to find out why but I would not say finding out I am autistic is similar to the trans experience, as autism is a real developmental disorder regarding how one thinks and behaves whereas being trans is seen more as a subjective feeling. I feel somewhat of a kinship to trans experiences regarding the aspect of not fitting in but not much else. As a twenty-one-year-old adult, I honestly do not feel as though I have developed mentally and emotionally. Some aspects of my personality and character such as my interest in history, my tendency to pause and think before answering a question, and extensive knowledge of certain subjects may give the appearance of maturity but I feel as though I am still a child. There are so many things about being an adult that are completely foreign and unknown to me. Although I have worked at my job for over a year, I feel unqualified to even have a job as my experience is still so limited. I wish so badly for independence but I am terrified of what that would be like for me as I need help and support with doing things like making phone calls, travelling, and managing my finances.
Why do you think the cohort of patients in Gender Clinics has changed so dramatically in recent years and is now mostly young females? And many of them presenting with Autistic Traits?
As someone who could have been one of those young females looking to transition, I can understand why this is the case. Many of these young autistic females believe that they are bad at being female and want to escape the negative stereotypes of womanhood. They see being a man as more freeing than being a woman and think transitioning will help them fit in better and feel a part of a community. The oversexualization of women in the media is also a contributing cause as these girls may believe the only way to not be objectified by men is to become one.
Do you struggle to find quality information on Autism and Gender that is not ideological?
I think there are issues with the ways autism organizations either fail to address gender in relation to autism or do it in a way that affirms whatever a person chooses to identify as. This should be one of the main concerns of an organization that attempts to raise the quality of life of autistic people, yet it is rarely discussed in a fact-based manner. I am not someone who has ever had confidence in the autism organizations. While I am sure they do some good things, so much of the information these organizations put out about autism and gender lacks nuance and fails to address the many autistic detransitioners who have been deeply hurt by the gender industry.
Do you think Gender Affirming Care is another form of Eugenics?
I think it is possible that gender affirming care is related to eugenics and that autistic people are being targeted. The majority of neurotypical people still view being autistic as less-than-ideal and there are some out there who want to eradicate autism entirely.
How important is an Autism diagnosis, and does it stop being important if someone is questioning their gender? Should Gender Clinics be assessing for Autism if they note autistic traits in patients? Should Autism Specialists be placed in Gender Clinics? Is addressing autism/mental health exploration in gender distressed individuals Conversion Therapy?
Gender clinics should 100% be assessing patients for autism before undergoing any medical procedures. There should be autism specialists who can identify those with autistic traits and explain what it means to be autistic to those who get diagnosed. I do not think addressing autism or any mental health conditions in gender distressed individuals is conversion therapy. Rather, it should be required before any hormones are prescribed to ensure that the patient is not transitioning for some reason that had nothing to do with gender dysphoria. Finding out that one is autistic can do away with the patient's desire to transition in some cases and if this is not known beforehand, the person may regret going through with a transition.
Do you think it is invalidating to address a patient's possible Autism when in Gender Clinics? If Transitioners find out they are autistic later down the line after transition, can/should the gender clinics be held accountable?
I do not think it is invalidating to address possible autism in gender clinics. Medically transitioning is a big deal as it cannot be undone so the utmost caution must be taken. Gender clinics should be held accountable if an autistic patient finds out they are autistic later on. I firmly believe every autistic person has the right to know they are autistic and that this information should not be concealed.
Do you think Autism is losing its meaning because of Self Diagnosis? If a Neurotypical person identifies as Autistic, should they be included in autism spaces & research? Can NTs who identify as Autistic speak on behalf of Autistic people?
I do not think autism loses its meaning because of self diagnosis. I myself am self diagnosed as I have never had the opportunity to get an autism diagnosis and there are many others like me out there. It is impossible for me to determine if all or what proportion of self diagnosed autistic people are actually autistic, though there are probably a few neurotypicals who call themselves autistic for attention or to feel special. I do not think anyone should be able to identify as autistic. Only those who have done a significant amount of research on autism, are fully convinced that they are autistic, and have friends or family members who agree with them on this should identify as autistic. Neurotypicals who identify as autistic should not be accepted in autism spaces and research nor should they be allowed to speak on behalf of autistic people.
Do you think it's OK to allow children to transition? Do you think it's OK to allow adults to transition? Do you think pausing puberty is OK to do? Do you think children can consent? Do you think children are being told the truth?
I do not think it is ever okay for children to transition. As for adults, I would not personally support someone transitioning but I do not think gender transitions should be completely banned. Mental health checks should be done beforehand and there should be some requirement of therapy to possibly mitigate the person's gender dysphoria. Pausing puberty is never okay as children cannot consent to this. Children are likely not being told the whole truth regarding the negative side effects that come along with these sorts of procedures, and even if they were, they are still too young to really understand what they are getting into.
Do you think there is a Social Contagion issue with Gender Ideology? Does Gender Non Conformity play a role?
I do believe there is a social contagion issue with gender ideology. Someone is more likely to transition if someone else in their friend group already has and being trans has become trendy in some social circles. Gender nonconformity does play a role in some people wanting to transition as being a tomboy is not really a thing anymore. The rise of gender ideology has only made it harder to be gender nonconforming, not easier.
What information do you think Autistic people, who are caught up in Gender Ideology, need to help them see out of the ideological thinking?
I think hearing the stories of autistic detransitioners is the best way for autistic people to stop believing in gender ideology as that shows the real-world negative impacts the gender ideology has on autistic people. Challenging gender ideology should become a matter of discussion in autistic spaces.
If you are, or have been, part of LGBTQIA+, how do you feel about LGBTQIA+ now? Should LGB separate from TQ+? Do you attend Pride Events?
I am asexual but do not identify as "queer" or as part of the LGBTQIA+ community. Personally, I do not think asexuality should be included among these various identities. I do not see why there is any need for such a broad community to exist as the various groups included have different goals and should not be forced together. There is already legal equality in Western countries for these people so LGBTQIA+ activism seems pointless. I have never attended a pride event nor do I ever plan on doing so. I do not really feel that there is a community for me as asexual communities and spaces are often very gender affirming and probably would not welcome me if they knew my views on gender.
Do you think gender ideology frees people from gendered stereotypes or reinforces them? Why do you care about Women’s Rights or Single Sex Spaces? What do you think the public thinks Trans Rights means?
I believe gender ideology only serves to reinforce gender stereotypes by basically telling gender nonconforming people to transition. Gender ideology relies on the existence of gender stereotypes, as the people who do not fit the stereotypes for their birth sex may feel pressure to transition. I care about women's rights because I am a woman and I realize that women are on average more vulnerable than men and their rights should be protected. I think the public has a different idea of what "trans rights" are than what trans activists mean. The public mainly understands it to be trans people having the same rights as everyone else and being treated with dignity and respect.
Can you tolerate and respect differing views and beliefs? Do you feel your views and beliefs are tolerated and respected?
I can totally tolerate differing views and beliefs though there are many beliefs I cannot respect. I am a supporter of free speech and believe everyone should be able to hold and share their own opinions.
Do you think the Autism Spaces are ideological about gender and that is having an effect on people in the groups? Do you think Autism groups are pushing more people into Trans spaces through ideological allegiance to the movement? Do you feel autism spaces have become echo chambers or enthralled to gender ideology?
I do think autism groups promoting gender ideology could result in more autistic people gravitating towards a trans identity. These spaces do sometimes feel like echo chambers, especially when people are encouraged to introduce themselves by telling people their pronouns.
Do you think Trans Rights Activists (TRAs) speak for all trans people? Do you think trans people are in a difficult position with the Trans community because of the extreme activism happening?
I do not think that trans rights activists speak for all trans people and I think trans people who do not buy into gender ideology are in a difficult position as there is a lot of pressure on them to conform to the most radical beliefs.
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Serious question: does "not feeling like a man/woman" mean anything more than the individual doesn't fit the gender stereotypes? I never assumed that men and women did or should fit the stereotype, but how you get from not fitting the stereotype to not feeling like a man/woman... What is a man/woman meant to feel like??? I never assumed that there was anything in particular that a man or woman felt like, however you felt was what being a man/woman felt like. (From someone (in the queer alphabet but not trans) who clearly doesn't get the whole trans thing... Gender liberation was my thing, and I'm appalled by the reification of gender stereotypes by trans ideology.)